Speaker 0:
Good day. Welcome to the third quarter review here on a a TV with our guest senior economist Milani Maule of Absa Corporate and Investment Bank. Welcome,

Speaker 1:
Milani. Ah, thank you very much for having me. It's good to be on the show.

Speaker 0:
So we're looking at a review of the third quarter and also a little bit of a look ahead at what to expect in the fourth quarter. I think before we even look at the quarters Milani the last week has been really interesting with inflation surprising to the upside. Do you wanna talk about that? I think you were one of the closest economists with your forecast of 4.9%.

Speaker 1:
Yeah, that's absolutely right. I think you know it. It did come as a bit of a surprise. Everyone was kind of thinking,

Speaker 1:
you know, inflation should ease. We've been in this environment for the last couple of years where, uh, we've had elevated inflation. You know, you will remember that at some point last year we had inflation running at at at 7.8% and what's really been the biggest challenge? Uh, for a lot of households, for a lot of consumers here in South Africa is that, uh, their wages, their incomes have not been keeping up.

Speaker 1:
Uh, you know, with where this inflation has been. So I, I think, uh, of course, the print of 4.7% is a very welcome print in that environment because it tells us that, uh, you know the worst. As far as, um, you know, these inflation pressures over the last couple of years

Speaker 1:
is, uh is concern is behind us now, uh, and basically, with at 4.7% that's a two year low for inflation and I, I think when we look at what's actually driving, um, you know, that inflation, it's also a little bit encouraging, right? I mean, part of it was expected.

Speaker 1:
Fuel inflation has come down a little bit. I'm sure you're gonna ask me more about that. Uh, but when you also look at, um, you know, some of the key categories that we know had been a big challenge. Uh, like food price inflation, you know, we're starting to see that, um, come down. You know, you look across other areas of the basket price pressures, um, you know, are coming down in a very broad based fashion, and I think that's really encouraging right now.

Speaker 0:
So what is the inflation outlook now for the end of the year?

Speaker 1:
Yeah, it's a good question because you know when when you start to get to 4.7% it's very close to the midpoint, Uh, of the target range that the South African Reserve Bank is saying is effectively their target and not just 3 to 6. And the question now is, you know, are we actually going to see inflation fall even further? You know, or, you know, is this a low point in this cycle? Our view is that

Speaker 1:
this is probably the low point in this cycle, and we're probably going to see inflation tick up a little bit. But we don't think we're going to, to to the levels of inflation that we've seen last year, the 7.8 inflation outside of the target range. We just think we're gonna bubble up a little bit to get into about 5.5% by September. But we think after that

Speaker 1:
we should see, um, headline inflation come down, um, again. So basically what we're dealing with here is that yes, it is still AAA softening path for inflation. But we just need to appreciate that it was never going to be linear

Speaker 1:
because over the next couple of months, specifically, and it's, uh, you know, we know that there's been a little bit of, of of fuel price pressure. You know, we we're talking here. We're looking at September. There are some chunky fuel price increases that are coming through. You know, after a number of months where we haven't really seen those, the effects of that are going to come through in headline inflation. So our expectation is that over the next few months, do expect headline inflation to pick up a little bit. Uh, but getting to about 5.5. And then from there,

Speaker 1:
we think we should ease some more, uh, getting to about 5% by the end of the year.

Speaker 0:
And then I think the million dollar question everybody always has when inflation moves, particularly now that it's moved into the target band. Um so, so definitively is does that mean we can look to see some relief on the interest rate hiking cycle? The governor did pause the hikes. But are we looking at possible cuts in the in the next quarter?

Speaker 1:
We we, we have to talk a little bit about,

Speaker 1:
uh how how the thinks about this environment. Um, you know, they are looking at the same inflation data that you and I are looking at. They've seen the 4.7%. Uh, they will like the 4.7% for sure. It's very close to the mid point of the target range.

Speaker 1:
But the N PC has also been telling us, uh, over the last few meetings that they're not just thinking about, uh, the most recent CP I prints. They're also thinking about the risks to the outlook. Right? And they've been saying to us that although headline inflation has come down, there is a number of things over the horizon. Uh, that that keeps them up late at night. And it's and that is you still have a lot of upside risks

Speaker 1:
to the inflation outlook. What exactly are these upside risks to the inflation outlook? One. We've spoken about food prices and the fact that they've come down. But looking ahead, we know that a lot of the risks around that path is very much to the upside. You know, we've been in a space where Russia has pulled out of the, um, Black Sea grains deal. No one really knows what that is going to mean for international grain grain prices going forward. Uh, we know that recently India

Speaker 1:
decided to ban the export of some varietal of rice. Uh, we've already started to see rice prices picking up. That's a source of it's a possible source of upside pressure on food prices. And domestically,

Speaker 1:
we know that over the last four years or so, it's been really great, really good rainfall. We've been in La Nina conditions, but we've we've been told that over the next few months over the next couple of quarters, we're probably going to be, uh, in El Nino conditions. It's a possible outside risk to the inflation outlook over the horizon. And I I'm sure we're gonna talk about this a little bit later on and this load shedding as well. We tend to think about it as a

Speaker 1:
growth negative growth shock, right? It's bad for businesses, businesses struggle to operate. Loadshedding is also an inflation shock in the sense that it increases the cost of doing business and elevates the risk that the cost pressures that businesses are feeling

Speaker 1:
passed on. To you and me, this so the is is looking at all of this. But they are also looking at, uh, the global interest rate environment because we know that one of the challenges that we've had to deal with is that, you know, we've seen some of the major central banks, like the US fed, uh, the ECB, uh, the Bank of England. They've been hiking interest rates. And in an environment where rates remain elevated in that space,

Speaker 1:
it gets harder for the South African Reserve Bank to ease rates here. Uh, because we may suffer some capital outflows that is going to affect the exchange rate is just going to generate even more inflation. So where the summer is sitting right now, it's they're basically saying, Well, inflation has come down. That's great. But you still have a lot of risks here, and we think M PC is probably going to be thinking from where we are,

Speaker 1:
it's best to wait and see how some of these risks play out before they rush into cutting interest rates. So we are not expecting, uh, an interest rate to come this year. Uh um, unfortunately, uh, but we do think that scope is gonna open up, uh, for some easing in interest rates. Uh, only next year, as some of these risks that we're discussing start to fall away, or as we start to get a little bit of clarity in terms of how things play out. So

Speaker 0:
So I think Let's look at the positive side, right? If interest rates are gonna hold at current levels, isn't that good news for consumers or retail investors looking to lock those higher interest rates into Sorry, a fixed deposit kind of investment?

Speaker 1:
Yeah, It's a good question, I. I should be clear. I'm an economist. I'm not an investment advisor. So you know, I, I cannot say to to to people what they should do and what they should not do. Uh, but you know it from from where we're sitting, uh, looking at inflation dynamics, looking at the risks, looking at, uh, where where, where the growth story is,

Speaker 1:
we don't think there is a lot more, uh, to the upside. As far as the interest rates are are concerned. We think the next move from where we are, uh, is going to be down. Uh, you know, even if it's a little bit later into next year, we we do think that the next move for rates, uh, is definitely downward from here.

Speaker 0:
And then we've got a very distressed South African consumer looking for that relief. Um, the inflation, I think, was good news for the consumer. But

Speaker 0:
also, I believe in the last week we saw banks of salary data coming through showing us that for the second month in the row, salaries increased year on year incrementally, but still a little bit good. How does that outlook bode for for the South African consumer? Yeah,

Speaker 1:
it's a it's It's a really important point, you know, I think, you know, even for growth here in South Africa overall, because when you think about

Speaker 1:
where the growth discourse has been for most of this year, you know, you could argue correctly, So we've all just been thinking about load shedding. You know, we see it is in front of us every day. Uh, but the consumer is also a critical driver of growth here in South Africa. If you look at our GDP numbers from the demand side, you know, upwards of 60% of our GDP

Speaker 1:
is household consumption expenditure. So you know when consumers don't feel very good about the economy or don't have the money to spend in the economy, that that also weighs on on on economic growth. And I think you're absolutely correct that consumers have been under a lot of

Speaker 1:
pressure and we're talking about consumers who have jobs here. Uh, not consumers who don't have any jobs at all because they have not seen, uh, their wages, their salaries going up as much as inflation has, uh, these are households and consumers who have seen the cost of servicing their debt rise very, very rapidly. Right, Because if you think back to where we were,

Speaker 1:
uh, in the middle of 2021 for the rapper rate it was it was very, very low. 3.5%. And we're talking here. Today, the R rate is sitting at 18.25%. So there's been a very rapid escalation, uh, in interest rates, and people have seen that

Speaker 1:
in the cost of servicing their debt. So So sure. I think if we are right that we're getting into a space where interest rates start to stabilise, uh, inflation starts to to to ease that. That will certainly be a little bit of good news for consumers from a real disposable income. I think going forward, they are going to find that the money that is sitting in their pocket or gets a little bit more stable in terms of what they are actually able to buy when they go to the grocery store.

Speaker 0:
Absolutely. And then in terms of the outlook for the rand, are you still expecting that to close at around 18 rand for the year?

Speaker 1:
Yeah. Look, you know, forecasting the rand is is is a very difficult exercise. Uh, you know, it's always entirely possible that over the course of the conversation that you and I are having here, and it's, uh, you know, the rand moves by by by 50 cents to the dollar in any in any direction. But what we've been thinking is, is is that if if we look at why the rand had weakened as much as it had over the last few months, there's been a lot of risk factors that went into that.

Speaker 1:
Um so if you think back to last last few months, for instance, we We were at a point in May where, uh, you know, we were very concerned about the possibility of grid failure. That was a discussion point in South Africa. Uh And then, of course, the big bombshell. When the US ambassador to South Africa released a statement saying, Oh, you know, we may have supplied arms to Russia and then they started to have additional concerns in the market about South Africa being possibly being hit

Speaker 1:
by sanctions, being possibly hit by, you know, an exit from a go. And I think the market started to reflect a lot of those risks, uh, into into the price. And our view is that what you ended up with is a rand move that was just overdone and and quite a bit out of touch with what we believe, Uh, you know, the rand should be valued from a fair value perspective. Uh, so where we are right now, we still think that,

Speaker 1:
uh, some of those risk factors may still be a little bit in in in in the price. When we look at the fair value of the rand, we think it should be, uh it should be stronger. So we think there is scope for it,

Speaker 1:
uh, to come back a little bit more. Uh, you know, we think it can get to about, uh, 17 95 by the end of the year. But I should stress, of course, that, you know, the the environment is characterised by a lot of uncertainty. Uh, there's still some big questions about, uh, global monetary policy. Big, big questions right now, uh, about about China's economic growth. What? How that is going to play out, whether we're going to see policy response from Chinese authorities

Speaker 1:
and what that is going to mean. There's a lot of unanswered questions, a lot of uncertainty, But But as we look at the rand where it is relative to where we think it's fair value given our fundamentals, we do believe that there is scope, uh, for for for the rand, uh, to pick up a little bit of muscle as we go into your end. A

Speaker 0:
little bit of muscle. I like that. So I think two of the major headwinds that you've already identified. When we're looking at the growth outlook,

Speaker 0:
um, on the horizon, that would be, um, El Nino with the, um affecting possible food security issues and the load shedding the load shedding scenario. I, I hate that we keep coming back to it, but I think it's such a big factor for South Africans. You can't you can't ignore all the different angles. And one of the things I've observed is, um, at one point, there was a lot of commentary and discourse around the possible privatisation of Eskom.

Speaker 0:
But we've seen the private sector come forward in another way with a different kind of privatisation, if you will, where they have put in their own energy supplies to keep the economy going literally.

Speaker 1:
Yeah, it's, uh it's been very interesting, I, I think, you know, just looking at

Speaker 1:
the the days on from the first half of this this year. And I think we can all remember, uh, when we were seeing, um, Stage five, stage six. Every day, all day, even over the weekends. Um, that, you know, we got to a point where the this call started to move a little bit away from?

Speaker 1:
Are we going to see a recession in this economy to We're definitely gonna see a recession in this economy. It's a question of just how deep the recession is going to be, Right. Uh, but I think something else has become a little bit clear over the last. Um uh, last couple of months and that is the economy has actually been stronger than anticipated, right? You look at the first quarter GDP numbers,

Speaker 1:
though we're positive we had GDP growth of 0.4% in Q one. It's quite remarkable, given how much loadshedding we actually had over that period. We had to see the second quarter numbers. Uh, but when you look at the high frequency data that have come through, that actually suggests that Q two GDP growth is also going to be positive. I think it's remarkable, uh, given what we've actually seen in the first half of the year, you know, we, we we we looked at these numbers, if you look at it in gigawatt hour terms,

Speaker 1:
the first half of this year, in terms of the intensity of load shedding, was seven times worse than what you saw in the first half of 2022 and roughly 30% worse than what you saw in all of 2022. So it's been a very challenging year. Uh, but we've actually seen economic activity be resilient. And I think it speaks precisely, uh, to this issue that, uh, that you're highlighting here. That and that is

Speaker 1:
the private sector has been doing a lot, uh, you know, to to put mitigation measures in in place and and one of the ways in which we see this This data from Eskom itself, which has started publishing some estimates in terms of you know how much households and businesses, uh, you know, have installed in terms of of of solar. And those numbers have gone from what about an estimated one gigawatt just in March of 2022.

Speaker 1:
And today we're sitting at about 4.7 gigawatts of capacity. That households and businesses have installed, uh, is one of the ways to mitigate against, uh, the disruptive effects, uh, of loadshedding. And that's just the renewable side of the story. We also know

Speaker 1:
very good data. And it, uh, the lots of businesses have also invested in, uh, diesel powered backup generation. Uh, and that, I think, is also making a a really, really huge difference. So, in a sense, you know, you could say, uh, you know, we we actually seeing generation becoming a lot more distributed, becoming privatised increasingly, uh, and you know, business is just basically saying,

Speaker 1:
if you're not, if you're not gonna privatise Eskom, maybe make generation a little bit more efficient. Well, generation is just gonna be privatised, uh, by by households and and and business naturally, because the regulatory environment allows for it.

Speaker 0:
And it's great for growth, right? I love that word. Resilient. Um, I think I don't know how many times I've heard about South Africans and our resilience, and I wish sometimes we weren't so resilient because I feel like we're almost tempting fate to throw all these headwinds at us. But, um, what are some of the sectors that you can identify that have been particularly resilient this year? Contributing to that GDP growth?

Speaker 1:
You know, this question is very interesting to me, and it's it's you look at the production side of the economy manufacturing, mining.

Speaker 1:
Those also happen to be the most energy intensive parts of the economy. Uh, but remarkably, you've had mining Q one first quarter of this year. It was up second quarter of this year. It was up again. Uh, you look at manufacturing. Uh, the first quarter of this year, it was up and again, we're seeing, uh, some growth that is coming through, uh, in in in the second quarter as as as as? Well, I remember some

Speaker 1:
one point. You know, we were also very concerned about, uh, what sort of tourism related parts of the economy may look like? Uh, so So, restaurants and catering services, uh, talk about our disruption is really big in that space accommodation services. It's a lot of stress, but when you actually look at the underlying data

Speaker 1:
away from the production side, we're also seeing that those parts of the economy are also showing some really good signs of continuing improvement. Uh, you look at the tourist arrivals or overseas tourist arrivals. Those numbers also continue to gradually pick up. We're not I you know, I have to report we're not quite back to pre-covid levels in terms of those numbers, but I think we're still on a right positive trend. and there's a lot of positive momentum that we're seeing, uh, in in in that space as well. And these are really some of the

Speaker 1:
the the the sectors of the economy that we're seeing contributing to this little bit of, uh, GDP growth that we're seeing coming through despite these waves of load shedding and

Speaker 0:
then looking back at the consumer again on household spending. And, you know, um, pressures on household spending where around the corner from that time of the month or that time of the year when there's another fuel increase or decrease possibly on the horizon. What is fuel inflation looking like at the at the moment? And what do you see Going forward?

Speaker 1:
Yeah, it's a it's a good question. So, you know, we're talking about headline inflation, um, being 4.7% as of the latest numbers.

Speaker 1:
Uh, fuel inflation. I should point out, uh, and it may come as a little bit curious to people. Fuel inflation was actually minus 16% on a year on year basis. So if you look at fuel prices, uh, today relative to last year, they're actually they're actually down. Um, but that's mostly base effects. Uh, and it doesn't, of course, mean that the levels are are are are are are that much lower?

Speaker 1:
I think looking at what we're seeing on on oil prices what we've seen on the of course over the last little while, it does look like there's a really big fuel price increase coming in September. Uh, so for petrol specifically, uh, we may be looking at something like 161 170 a litre. That's quite chary, right? Uh, but if you drive diesel car, it's even worse.

Speaker 1:
Uh, given the tightness that you have in the market given that the Northern Hemisphere, uh, is now going into its winter demand for diesel has picked up. It looks like we could see an increase in that space, Uh, of about 262 and 70 litre.

Speaker 1:
So, in the very short term, unfortunately, there is a little bit of pressure that is gonna come through, uh, from fuel prices. But I think given that the Rand has already retreated a little bit, uh, we've seen as well oil prices coming down a bit. We are not expecting, uh, that there's going to be significant. Additional fuel price pressure beyond what we're going to see in September Over the rest, Uh, over the rest of the year, although again, you know, I, I should emphasise

Speaker 1:
point about, uh, you know, the global environment being, uh, you know, still highly uncertain. I think there's still a lot of risks out there, but fundamentally, we we don't see. We don't see additional, uh, fuel price pressure beyond September.

Speaker 0:
Yes, I think the in the first half of this year already, if I'm not mistaken, there was a distinct increase in interest from consumers on hybrid and, um, and electric vehicles. And I think that's going to be a continuing trend as we go forward

Speaker 0:
into the new years to come. Um, and then looking at, you know, the consumer outlook. So we know that they're heavily indebted. We know that they're taking strain with interest rates and inflation and a decreasing pocket spend. But what are we looking at in terms of political uncertainty with elections around the corner? Yeah,

Speaker 1:
that's a good question. Um, we know that we we've got,

Speaker 1:
um, elections next year. Uh, probably in the second quarter of Of of the year and perhaps what makes these upcoming elections, uh, you know, a lot more interesting than, uh uh. What we've seen in in in the past is that there's been a lot of polling data. Uh, that's been coming through from from from various pollsters suggesting that, you know, we may be looking at an election outcome like we've never seen.

Speaker 1:
Uh uh, before you know, some of these polls suggesting that the governing African National Congress may not be able, uh, to secure its its its majority. Now, for some people, you know, that is a that is a source of uncertainty, right? Because it means that we may possibly have to go into a coalition government at a national level, which is something that, uh, we've we we've never seen before.

Speaker 1:
Difficult to know how, uh, you know, different people sort of process this information, But, you know, when you look at all of these other additional pressures that the consumer has been feeling, uh, it's very clear in the consumer confidence data across all income groups. And interestingly enough, uh, high income groups,

Speaker 1:
uh, are reporting some of the lowest levels, uh, of consumer confidence right now, that we've seen in a very long time. So So it's possible. I think that it may just be a reflection of, uh, some of the economic hardship that people have felt, you know, with their wages being under pressure

Speaker 1:
from a real perspective, Uh, the additional interest rate, uh, burden that they've had to to to to feel over the last little while inflation, that is also, uh, picked up. But I think it's also possible that, uh, you know, some uncertainty about just what the future looks like. Uh may be creeping in a little bit, uh, into into this consumer confidence now

Speaker 1:
and that ultimately affects you know whether people decide to open up their wallets and spend a little bit more or not. And right now, consumer confidence is really very low,

Speaker 0:
and I think I also want to touch on service delivery issues there, particularly at municipal level. I mean, if I look at, I think it was this week was in court because they were

Speaker 0:
on a court case where residents have just decided they're going to pay their municipal rates into a trust account rather than to the municipality because they haven't been receiving services.

Speaker 1:
It's a big issue. I think, um, you know, the the the the trust levels between residents and and and municipalities across different areas,

Speaker 1:
it's probably coming down and not surprising. We see this, I think Excuse me every year from the auditor General's report, just in terms of you know, how the municipalities are doing. Uh, we We've seen this from various businesses here in South Africa. You know, we had to come out and say they can no longer function in certain municipalities because service delivery has become so bad they have to move to a different jurisdiction.

Speaker 1:
Um, you've seen his stories from businesses coming on and saying, You know, the road that connects my business to the highway is basically become nonexistent.

Speaker 1:
I know to spend money, uh, trying to To To to to bring that road back. We we see these kind of stories. I think it's very unhelpful. Uh, it obviously just, you know, very directly affects the lives of residents in those in in in those communities. But also more critically, I think from a macro perspective, it feeds into this slow business confidence environment.

Speaker 1:
Uh, that we've been dealing with you know, in addition, of course, to the other big infrastructure gaps. Uh, I think the the the issue of municipalities is not being able to deliver the basic services that they need to deliver. It's a big challenge for, for for confidence and for for longer term investment and for longer term growth in this economy.

Speaker 0:
Absolutely. And then, I think, to wind up let's look at the current account deficit. That's is is the macro view that the current account deficit is widening still. And what are some of the domestic bottlenecks?

Speaker 1:
Yeah, it's a it's a good question. So, you know, 2021 was a very good year for us. We had a current account surplus That's very unusual for us, but it was there. But I think even then

Speaker 1:
it was clear that the current account surplus it was not likely to be sustained. And the reason being that a big part of that current account surplus just came primarily from higher commodity prices. Uh, you know, it did not come from us. Uh, exporting more goods. Uh, you know, producing more. It was just the price effect of the fact that the stuff that we're pulling out of the ground, Uh, was fetching more from the international market.

Speaker 1:
Uh, commodity prices have come down a lot. You know, you look at the PGM space, you look at rhodium prices. It's unbelievable. Uh, how big the collapse has been in that space over the last, uh, last few months. So that commodity price tailwind that we have enjoyed, uh, in our current economy started to fall away. So by 2022 already,

Speaker 1:
we were back in a more familiar space, uh, of current account deficit. It was still a small current account deficit of just 0.5% of GDP. Uh, but for this year, we actually think that the current account deficit is going to widen even more, Uh, to about 2.5% of, of of GDP. It's just a lot harder,

Speaker 1:
I think, to sustain current account surpluses when you are not able to produce significantly more, uh, as an economy. Uh, and when you've got, uh, challenges with your rail infrastructure, you know, we've had this from, uh, some of the major coal producers, for instance. Uh, you know, we that you know what? They're actually able

Speaker 1:
to produce. They can't get out every single year. When you've got these challenges, you've got, uh, poor efficiency issues. It becomes really hard, I think, uh, for for an economy to just, uh, to just be able to to lift export performance in in in a sustained way. So we are expecting that, uh, the current account deficit is going to widen this year to about 2.5% of GDP.

Speaker 0:
And how how does government fund that current account deficit?

Speaker 1:
Yeah, so? So, Look, I mean, of course, the way in which, uh, the South African Economy works. We we don't, uh, We we don't We don't

Speaker 1:
directly affects, uh, the value of of of the currency. So in a space where, um, you know, your current account deficit widens. Uh, the exchange rate has to, uh, is is gonna have to to to adjust. So the government has no role to play at all.

Speaker 1:
Um, with the current account deficit. But the deficit that is going to matter, uh, for the government is the fiscal deficit deficit, which is also being very directly, uh, affected by, uh, these lower commodity prices. We know that the big commodity price. Tailwind did allow the national treasury

Speaker 1:
to to to get some revenue over runs over the last couple of years. But we think that story, uh, is kind of run out now. We're actually expecting the budget deficit, uh, to be wider. And the government there very directly has to think about you know, how to, um, how to close that gap. Uh, and I think it's it's it's an ever going challenge, uh, on how to sort of deliver sustainable fiscal consolidation here in South Africa.

Speaker 0:
Well, thanks, Milani. That's a lot to think about. A lot of, um, different factors to consider. I have to say, um, if I review the conversation we've just had and the outlook we've come from and where we are going to Can you imagine if if we didn't have load shedding and if everything in this country actually worked, can you imagine the things we could do?

Speaker 1:
Like No, absolutely. You know,

Speaker 1:
IIII I started covering, um, South Africa just a little more than a, uh uh, a decade ago, you know, and I've always held this view. Still hold this view, uh, that that this is an economy that holds a huge amount of potential, you know, And, uh, the things that we have to fix, We know exactly what they are, and, you know, we just need to get

Speaker 1:
down to fixing those things, uh, making sure that we create an environment in which businesses feel confident that they can build new things. And those things can thrive over the long run. And I think we can unleash, uh, you know, a huge amount of that potential that just always sits underneath us.

Speaker 1:
Uh, you know, if if we're able to address our infrastructure constraints able to address, uh, some of the regulatory issues that we have and just eliminate that trust deficit, uh, that you have between policymakers and, uh, in private businesses.

Speaker 0:
Absolutely. Thank you for joining us for this edition of the third quarter Economic Review from Absa Corporate Investment Bank. Thank you, Milani, for being our lovely guest today and goodbye.

Speaker 1:
Thank you very much for having me